Different versions of 802?

[Coendert2011]

Hello all,

I am in the possession of apparently two types of 802s. One pair stemming from the 60s and one recently acquired pair from the 70s.

They both are branded as 802s, yet there are however striking differences between the two. The 70s version is 1/4 inch smaller and no less than 0.5 kg lighter (2.5 vs 3 kg for the earleir version). Furthermore the newer ones have a smooth surface and no taper.

At first I was under the impression that the 70s versions actually are 806 or something, but those seem to be even smaller.

So what is the deal on the 802?

If there is any forum that could shed light on this matter it would be this one!

Regards, Coen

Sorry for the metric notation.

[Altec Best]

Posting pictures will go a long way in helping you determine what you have.As you are a new member you may have to wait a couple days.But anyway "Welcome to the Board"

[bowtie427ss]

Old style(60's) on the left, new style(70's) on the right.

[Coendert2011]

Thanks for the welcome!

Bowtie's pictures illustrate the external differences perfectly. I have different rear caps on the rough units though. Also I ( mistakenly?) reversed the dating. I took a fait little stamp on the side of the polepiece for a date code. That suggested 60 something for the rough ones (right in the pic above) and 70 something for the other ones.

I am still curious about the weight difference. Is is due to a smaller magnet, less casing material or both?

The lighter, smaller and smooth units do seem to have a little less output, yet sound fine nevertheless.

[Steve Schell]

The later 802s used a cast pot structure rather than one welded from pipe and plate stock. Dare I suggest that this was likely a cost saving measure, as with the Tangerine phasing plug? I do know that the cast pot assemblies on JBL cone speakers were begun in 1953 as a cost saving measure.

[GM]

The lighter, smaller and smooth units do seem to have a little less output, yet sound fine nevertheless.

They are both rated at 15,250 Gauss and both should weigh the same at ~7 lbs, but the later 802G design has its BW shifted up a little higher to make it better overall with the M19's ~1200 Hz XO as well as do a better job of reproducing the increased HF BW output around that time. The trade-off is that the 'G' isn't as strong down low when XO'd at 500 Hz which with today's very low output impedance systems is actually a good thing overall.

GM

[Coendert2011]

According to my converter 7lbs is 3,175 gram.

The slightly smaller smooth units weigh about 2,550 gram or 5,62 lbs.

They are not the 'tangerine' g version, but have ordinary circular slots. I xo around 750 hz with a second order LR.

I will try to make some illustrative photos and post them here (if possible).

[Altec Best]

Are there any kind of numbers on the back cover caps ? When Altec didn't use any kind of sticker/label they just stamped the model #'s on the back cap. Ex. 033952 = 802-8G, 23746 = 806-8A etc....

[Coendert2011]

Are there any kind of numbers on the back cover caps ? When Altec didn't use any kind of sticker/label they just stamped the model #'s on the back cap. Ex. 033952 = 802-8G, 23746 = 806-8A etc....

Nothing on the rear covers. The polepiece has a code on its side though: 391217...

[Coendert2011]

I did some measuring and made some photographs I can't post yet.

Rough unit 1, 802-8D badged, without rear cover, loading cap, diaphragm and screws: 3,432 gram = 7.57 lb
Rough unit 2, no badge, same conditions: 3,313 gram = 7.30 lb

Interesting!

Extra stuff weighs 175 gram = 0.386 lb add to both to compare with below.

Length from polepiece to front for both units: 68mm = 2.68 inch

Smooth unit with all stuff attatched (to lazy to take it off): 2.866 gram = 6.32 lb

Length from polepiece to front: 64mm = 2.52 inch

So that's 4 mm of difference in length = 0.16 inch, and a weight difference of at least 3.488 (incl stuff) minus 2.866 = 622 gram or 1.37 lb (22.2 oz).

On the net the regular green 806 look quite different (my units are black).